Leviathan on January 23, 2009, 01:41:57 am
I would just like to point out that the IRS doesn't have nearly so convenient a loophole.  Whether the power has been legislatively granted or not, if you have anything that could be considered income they insist that you must declare it.  Save a few minor exceptions, like health insurance costs.  If the income is in the form of gold, silver, copper, or even coca cola bottles and it values as equivalent to a taxable income, they want you to declare it.  An example from awhile back, a boss gave his workers a bonus of a gold coin apiece.  The IRS went after the entire company, claiming it was undeclared income.  The only "loophole" was that at the time, it was valued significantly below the threshold of reporting for such trade items and therefore exempt.  The courts, however, did not in fact declare it as inherently untaxable.

That said, I do encourage people to find ways to trade outside of the system.  The less we, as a people, rely on the centralized authority for things the less power the authorities have.  The harder it is to track such things, as well. 

I bet that was anything but what Guy was expecting as the answer.  Quite surprised me, as well.  I guess the UWRS left a loophole so they wouldn't be wasting resources trying to pressure the uncivilized, and generally unwealthy, into filing forms to declare what they were barely earning anyway.  It helps, though, to confine the economy to the Continental when nobody's allowed to really bank without it.  One reason at least on the surface why there are a number of wealthy Jewish banking families is because the idiotic Catholic church hamstrung any banking institutions with the concept of usury.  Lending at interest being somehow criminal.  The Jewish-run institutions had no such qualms lending to the Gentiles.  The legal tender laws and centralization of banks across the planet results in an exclusion of significant financial institutions capable of operating at profit while using alternatives.  Lend in silver, land in jail.  Lend without license and sanction, land in jail.  It took well over a century before these assholes "weaned" us off harder currencies, even after they managed to centralize it all.  Said Cerereans, no doubt, have no qualms with operating banking institutions on whatever trade commodities they see fit.  So a better performing currency market ends up thriving.  A free market in them, heh.

ClaudiusPtolemy on January 23, 2009, 09:39:54 am
Only in Continentals? But Guy has an e-gold account (which apparently reconciles with Ceres' e-gold).

C'mon, Guy should at least make a respectable attempt to close the loophole -- that's an auditor's job!

Jackson on January 23, 2009, 10:21:23 am
Guy is still shocked by the claim. When he recovers, I'm sure he will try something. Although, Reginald has had days to prepare this, so he might be ready for anything Guy could try unless he gets really creative.

Rocketman on January 23, 2009, 10:53:50 am
Many (well over 20) years ago,  I had a brief conversation with a very nice woman who worked at the head office of the jobshop in another state that I was temporarily employed at.  I had to every week to call in the number of hours that I worked that week so they could write a check for the proper amount.  Prior to that they had received a notice from the IRS that they had underpaid their quarterly taxes by, I'm not kidding, one cent.  Since she worked in the accounting department and was well aware of what they could do she mailed them a check for that exact amount.  She didn't hear anymore from them for several months and then got a threatening letter from them stating that since they hadn't paid that they were adding additional charges and fees onto the original amount.  She told me the amount and I have since forgot but I remember that it was well over a hundred dollars.  She sent them a copy of the cancelled check as well as a copy of the letter that they had threatened the company with and they finally backed off.  I wouldn't be surprised if they had pulled that with a bunch of small companies just to get a little extra money and to intimidate them.

SandySandfort on January 23, 2009, 11:44:49 am
Only in Continentals? But Guy has an e-gold account (which apparently reconciles with Ceres' e-gold).
The people that make the rules always make sure they only apply to the governed. The UW is not really all that united. Certain enclaves and "associate sectors" are allowed to exist, because the Powers-That-Be use them for their own purposes. Thus Monaco, the Swiss-Liechtenstein Federation, the UAE, Kuna Yala and Uruguay are allowed a degree of internal autonomy when it comes to banking privacy, corporate structures, non-approved medical treatment, etc. Panama is allowed to have a limited parallel gold economy as well as the Continental economy. For one thing, there are Belters who who contract with the UW to clean up orbital junk and, more important, to deflect NEOs that threaten Terra. Belters don't take Continentals. So the UW has to pay them in gold or other "real" money. (All of these issues and elements will come up in future episodes of EFT.)

wdg3rd on January 23, 2009, 07:20:41 pm
The people that make the rules always make sure they only apply to the governed. The UW is not really all that united. Certain enclaves and "associate sectors" are allowed to exist, because the Powers-That-Be use them for their own purposes. Thus Monaco, the Swiss-Liechtenstein Federation, the UAE, Kuna Yala and Uruguay are allowed a degree of internal autonomy when it comes to banking privacy, corporate structures, non-approved medical treatment, etc. Panama is allowed to have a limited parallel gold economy as well as the Continental economy. For one thing, there are Belters who who contract with the UW to clean up orbital junk and, more important, to deflect NEOs that threaten Terra. Belters don't take Continentals. So the UW has to pay them in gold or other "real" money. (All of these issues and elements will come up in future episodes of EFT.)


I was guessing something like that halfway through Lev's post.  Like the UN, the UAE obviously has a number of members whose internal economies are totally dependent on barter.  Especially since the fall of their previous economies (i.e. Zimbabwe, and I keep hoping that the Mugger's government will fall with it, I'm tired of the crap and I don't even live there).
Ward Griffiths        wdg3rd@aol.com

Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.  --  Denis Diderot

Rocketman on January 24, 2009, 01:36:38 pm
The people that make the rules always make sure they only apply to the governed. The UW is not really all that united. Certain enclaves and "associate sectors" are allowed to exist, because the Powers-That-Be use them for their own purposes. Thus Monaco, the Swiss-Liechtenstein Federation, the UAE, Kuna Yala and Uruguay are allowed a degree of internal autonomy when it comes to banking privacy, corporate structures, non-approved medical treatment, etc. Panama is allowed to have a limited parallel gold economy as well as the Continental economy. For one thing, there are Belters who who contract with the UW to clean up orbital junk and, more important, to deflect NEOs that threaten Terra. Belters don't take Continentals. So the UW has to pay them in gold or other "real" money. (All of these issues and elements will come up in future episodes of EFT.)
 
      Seems entirely believable to me Sandy.  That reminds me of another story about how some "important" people don't believe that the law applies to them. 
     When Jane Fonda was still married to Tom Hayden they had a break in at their place in Santa Monica and called the police.  When the police got their they noticed that Mr. and Mrs.  Big time liberal both had guns on them.  One of the policemen asked them something along the lines of.  "I thought that both of you were anti-gun?"  "What's with the heavy hardware?"  To which Ms. Fonda replied (exact quote) "Oh, that's for other people not us."  Makes you wonder how many in Hollyweird would be promoting gun control if they knew that they're guns were going into the smelter along with everyone elses.  :o

Leviathan on January 25, 2009, 01:10:55 am
I recall one article concerning the war on drugs and how it initially started.  It really, to the people who were voting for it, was never believed to extend to anything they were going to be using.  Not the cocaine pick-me-ups they enjoyed (coca cola, anyone?), not the hemp tinctures which soothed their ills, not the hemp fibers they used in rope, twine, and cloth.  They were largely enacted to persecute specific groups, and many were surprised when their own favorite products disappeared or were fundamentally altered in the wake of the legislation.  There are two basic kinds of control freaks.  The first is people who desire to control others but would be aghast at being the target of the legislation.  Because they're scared of the "outside" group and will support seemingly unrelated bullshit just to get at them, or try and make themselves safe from that other group.  The second feels out of control if they're allowed to do something, and wants an outside agency to perform a deus ex machina and stop them from hurting themselves.  Both kinds are engaged in gun-grabbing, the drug war, and even taxation.  I've spent rather sizable amounts of time arguing with this one liberal who wandered into a channel I frequent.  He is happy that government takes his money and spends it for him so he doesn't have to think about it.  He'll redefine whatever he wants to in the constitution to support that position, and doesn't seem to understand the question "What makes that action moral to take against those who aren't willing?"  I think I'd classify him as the second category.  He's scared he wouldn't put anything aside or make arrangements if government weren't forcing him to, for the rainy day when he's out of work or whatever.  For examples of the first category, I'd classify every person who says we need some government because they believe without police and military we'd have something even worse than "just a little tyranny".  Most libertarians, I'm sad to say, fall into that category.  Sorry guys.

Monkt on January 25, 2009, 03:30:49 am
The people that make the rules always make sure they only apply to the governed. The UW is not really all that united. Certain enclaves and "associate sectors" are allowed to exist, because the Powers-That-Be use them for their own purposes. Thus Monaco, the Swiss-Liechtenstein Federation, the UAE, Kuna Yala and Uruguay are allowed a degree of internal autonomy when it comes to banking privacy, corporate structures, non-approved medical treatment, etc. Panama is allowed to have a limited parallel gold economy as well as the Continental economy. For one thing, there are Belters who who contract with the UW to clean up orbital junk and, more important, to deflect NEOs that threaten Terra. Belters don't take Continentals. So the UW has to pay them in gold or other "real" money. (All of these issues and elements will come up in future episodes of EFT.)
 
      Seems entirely believable to me Sandy.  That reminds me of another story about how some "important" people don't believe that the law applies to them. 
     When Jane Fonda was still married to Tom Hayden they had a break in at their place in Santa Monica and called the police.  When the police got their they noticed that Mr. and Mrs.  Big time liberal both had guns on them.  One of the policemen asked them something along the lines of.  "I thought that both of you were anti-gun?"  "What's with the heavy hardware?"  To which Ms. Fonda replied (exact quote) "Oh, that's for other people not us."  Makes you wonder how many in Hollyweird would be promoting gun control if they knew that they're guns were going into the smelter along with everyone elses.  :o
Its funny because under Sheriff Baca the only people who are issued CCW licenses are celebrities.

wdg3rd on January 25, 2009, 08:39:01 am
[
Its funny because under Sheriff Baca the only people who are issued CCW licenses are celebrities.
[/quote]

Baca has no authority over CCW unless you live in an unincorporated area (like I used to in Altadena where the local shirf station was totally out of control during the 80s), in Califnordia, that authority is claimed at the municipal level.  Caused a bit of a ruckus a while back when one of the County Supervisors couldn't get a CCW license from the city of LA and got it instead from Culver City.
Ward Griffiths        wdg3rd@aol.com

Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.  --  Denis Diderot