Sphynx on April 09, 2007, 08:19:59 pm
Rocketman, et al:  One of the greatest things that first attracted me to the principles of libertarianism and the ZAP is that I don't worry that someone who disagrees with a freely stated opionion necessarily wants to force me into compliance with his/her opposing opinion.  We recognize that each individual must choose thier own way to deal with an indifferent and potentially hostile universe.  This also liberates us to voice and defend our opions (and/or those of others).

I will state that my last posts on this subject may have left the impression that I see blades as superior to firearms as personal defense weapons.  This was not my intention, at all.  Each tool, whether for wood carving, car repair, or self defense has its strengths and weaknesses.  What my stated carry combination attempts to do, for my purposes, is to balance the utility of each weapon against normally expected needs.

Part of my personal concern, re: firearms use, is liability.  As a self-resposible individual, I must control my weapon, making sure of my target and using ever means possible to avoid any form of "fiendly-fire" incident.  From my point of view as a student of self-ownership, even if I fire in justifiable defense of my life/property (or that of others), if I miss my legitimate target, I, and I alone, am responsible for any damage caused by the my shot.

For many close in encounters, I'd like to have the option to use a weapon that has more limited range of effect, and therefore a more limited area-of-effect for accidental damage.

i'm turn 45 in two weeks, must be getting maudlin :)

While everything that your saying is technically true, I just don't feel comfortable with just an edged blade of any length Sphynx. I guess it has to do that with every movie that I've seen based on historical events the guys with the swords who need to get close enough to the guys with the Boom Boom weapons to cut and slash end up getting cut down (excuse the expression) before they can get within range.
Imagine a mugger with a gun that sees you carrying a katana on your hip and decides to rob you. All he has to do is stand back about 25 or 30 feet and order you to throw him your wallet. :P

With respect to the above stated hypothetical mugger, by this calculus, I imagine that the same mugger, intent on his crime, would shoot you in the back when he sees the gun you're carrying.  Since he's already shown his cowardice in choosing to use force to extract property by threat against the rightful owner's life, its no small step to take to simply use murder to eliminate the uncertainty in acquiring the property in question.

Like many, I think that most people want to go about thier own business.  I prepare to defend myself, where such action is needed, but accept that individuals exist who are, in one way or another, irrational enough to attack from a distance, without warning, like a government, and that I may be injured or killed by such attack, with no opportunity to defend myself at all. 

Rocketman on April 10, 2007, 07:10:11 pm
Point taken Sphynx.  I have a tendency to read so quickly through the other peoples posts that sometimes I don't completely understand what EXACTLY is being communicated.  I did originally believe that you were advocating edged weapons weilded by experts as superior to pistols.  MY BAD.  ;D   I consider myself a libertarian too and anything that you wish to use for self defense is not only fine with me, it's also none of
my damn business.  I agree with you that any gun is only a tool, no more different or dangerous than a hammer or a saw if controlled by a criminally minded individual.  Your point about a sword or other edged weapon limiting the possibility of harming someone outside of it's swing radius is well taken too.  Hope you forgive me.  :-[

Sphynx on April 10, 2007, 07:38:11 pm
Point taken Sphynx. I have a tendency to read so quickly through the other peoples posts that sometimes I don't completely understand what EXACTLY is being communicated. I did originally believe that you were advocating edged weapons weilded by experts as superior to pistols. MY BAD. ;D I consider myself a libertarian too and anything that you wish to use for self defense is not only fine with me, it's also none of
my damn business. I agree with you that any gun is only a tool, no more different or dangerous than a hammer or a saw if controlled by a criminally minded individual. Your point about a sword or other edged weapon limiting the possibility of harming someone outside of it's swing radius is well taken too. Hope you forgive me. :-[

No apology required.  We are not at odds, just clarifying a communications difficulty.  One of the reasons for my, possibly excessive, concern for unintended damage is that I've never been able to hold beter than 10 times bore/caliber size at 25 yards.  This is partially poor (but corrected) eye-sight, partially lack of $$ for practice time/ammo, et cetera.  All my own problem and responsibility.

Smile, sir, I'll stand at your back, if needed. :D

Rocketman on April 10, 2007, 11:19:08 pm
At the time I was practicing shooting to qualify for the IPSC class C division and firing about 150 to 200 practice rounds a week.  With all I've got to take care of now I'm lucky to fire 200 rounds a year right now although I've got a pistol range no further away than I can walk in 5 minutes.  A sad state of affairs indeed.   :'(
« Last Edit: April 10, 2007, 11:24:17 pm by Rocketman »

Bog on April 19, 2007, 04:28:01 am
I don't know if it's poor form to post blog links in this forum, if it is I apologise in advance and will edit the post on criticism.   However, the turn this has taken into blade-land seems to make http://munchkinwrangler.blogspot.com/2007/03/good-sword.html this link to a friend's blog quite appropos :)

Strangely, I'd completely blanked on the topic of blades.  Too much time living aboard USS Blaire, America's Slowest Aircraft Carrier....

Rocketman on April 19, 2007, 08:05:11 pm
Bog-
  In your opinion, which I value because your there, do you see any public backlash starting against the gun prohibition in England because of the increasing crime rate?  I've heard that there has been a few editorials in various newspaper to the effect that maybe it wasn't such a good idea for the good guys to have been disarmed.

Bog on April 20, 2007, 08:43:00 pm
*eyes the horizon sadly*

Sir, no sir.  The standard Socialist cry of "Protect us more!  Make these terrible knives more illegal!  Guns are already illegal, so we'll ignore the 46% leap in handweapon usage in home burglaries over the last year because we have KNIVES which kill us now!  We must install "knife arches"  (that would be "metal detectors" to the sapient) in our places of hostelry!"

Reason H. Science.   I gotta get outta here...

O you who turn the wheel and look to windward,
Consider Phlebas, who was once handsome and tall as you.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2007, 08:45:02 pm by Bog »

Rocketman on April 20, 2007, 10:10:53 pm
You have my deepest and most sincere condolences Bog.  As someone who believes in liberty living there must make you feel about as welcome as a vegetarian at a beef barbeque.  I can't beleve you haven't already left, especially since you could do your computer work from somewhere where you still could own and carry a handgun and speak your mind without the nanny state reguarding you as a danger to the status quo.

wdg3rd on April 21, 2007, 12:41:48 am
You have my deepest and most sincere condolences Bog.  As someone who believes in liberty living there must make you feel about as welcome as a vegetarian at a beef barbeque.  I can't beleve you haven't already left, especially since you could do your computer work from somewhere where you still could own and carry a handgun and speak your mind without the nanny state reguarding you as a danger to the status quo.

Vegetarians are always welcome at a barbecue.  First, they provide comic relief.  Then, in case the main supply gets used up, there's something else lower on the food chain to throw on the grill.
Ward Griffiths        wdg3rd@aol.com

Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.  --  Denis Diderot

41 mag on April 22, 2007, 02:15:03 am
bog i seem to rember a story on cnn that there was a serious effort being made in the u.k. to ban heavy glass beer mugs as too many people where getting their skulls cracked by them in pub brawls. any truth?

Bog on April 22, 2007, 11:15:51 am
bog i seem to rember a story on cnn that there was a serious effort being made in the u.k. to ban heavy glass beer mugs as too many people where getting their skulls cracked by them in pub brawls. any truth?

As barking mad as it may seem, I'm afraid that's a done deal.   Every time there's a "football" (soccer) match, not only do we have mounted police (!) in the tiny town of Reading where I live, and hundreds of uniformed cops, the beer glasses are all taken down in pubs, with pints served in softish plastic vessels.  Safety glasses, for a safety culture.  Praise the State!

As to why I'm still here?  I made a bit of a duff choice in the animation software I learned - the market for we LightWavers is quite small.  I'm boning up on Maya as fast as I can, so I can get the hell out of Dodge before either I go insane, or some moron mistakes me for a sheep and I end up in the dock.  It's sort of a prerequisite for me to be able to find gainful employment on my return to the US, both from a practical and a pride perspective.  There's also the minor thing of every pound I earn being worth two dollars back home right now, so I'm kinda making the most of that situation while it obtains.

Rocketman on April 22, 2007, 04:13:16 pm
Bog:
     Your last post about just how insane that England has become reminds me of two sayings.
     !.  You don't have to be crazy to live here but it does help.
     2.  When only the police have guns, it's called a police state.

                     Don't let the bastards grind you down.  ;D ;D ;D

Bog on April 23, 2007, 10:23:54 am
Pffft.  Sadly, despite being quite armed in a lot of cases, training standards leave a lot to be desired.  Like, all of it.  The number of times I've seen a cop with an MP-5 slung with his booger-hook on the bang switch as a torrent of commuters flow around him makes me go white just thinking about it.  Here's another thought for you:  In a disarmed society, where guns are villified and reviled, there can be no "Safe Gun Handling".  Everyone's too busy either cringing from their Evil Black Baby-Murdering Machine that's all ready to leap out of their hands and ruin their pensions, or - worse - fulfulling every pathetic little tin-god dream they've ever had because for them, finally, the jackboot's on the other foot.

Suffice it to say, staying off the radar of local law enforcement is very high on my list of priorities.   I know I'm probably a little deranged to still be here - taking the choice of doing work I love and living as a subject, or flipping burgers and living free - but I've lived in the Uck since I was 2, apart from six months working in NYC ten years back.  It's a heck of a thing, to uproot at age 30-something, and take a flyer.   I guess in a way, I'm still plucking up courage.   Just knowing I'll have a job and an income will be a big thing.

Heh.   Sorry, got a bit personal there.   Happy St. George's day.   

wdg3rd on April 23, 2007, 02:44:18 pm
Suffice it to say, staying off the radar of local law enforcement is very high on my list of priorities.   I know I'm probably a little deranged to still be here - taking the choice of doing work I love and living as a subject, or flipping burgers and living free - but I've lived in the Uck since I was 2, apart from six months working in NYC ten years back.  It's a heck of a thing, to uproot at age 30-something, and take a flyer.   I guess in a way, I'm still plucking up courage.   Just knowing I'll have a job and an income will be a big thing.
There are thousands of folks ranging from their teens to at least their 70s in the process of uprooting and taking flyers to New Hampshire.  I'll be going within a year and a half.  If I can't manage to open my restaurant, I'll bag groceries at Shaw's.  I'll be 52 in five weeks.  www.freestateproject.org

Ward Griffiths        wdg3rd@aol.com

Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.  --  Denis Diderot

Bog on April 23, 2007, 02:59:51 pm
Thanks, Mr. Griffiths.  I'll do my best to remember that I don't need to be carrying to be courageous.